Option for manual trans?

[mccombs]

Since the t5 adapters are no longer available. What are my options for manual transmissions for my v8?

[cgrey8]

I'm not sure I understand the question. T5 adapter? And what V8 block is it you are using?

[mccombs]

It's a 302 crate motor from ford. Here's the Adapter I've seen people reference: http://www.jamesduff.com/broncoII/v8conversion.html and http://www.therangerstation.com/tech_li ... sions.html

Will a t5 not work without an adapter? Any other manual trans options?

[cgrey8]

Ahhh, the missing detail I wasn't getting is that you are 4wd and need a T5 tail shaft adapter AND tail shaft to mate the T5 to a transfer case. Yeah your options are limited to whatever production transmission that was ever made for 4wd vehicles since the T5. I know the F150s have some Mazda manual transmission for their 4wd apps, but from everything I've heard about them is their torque handling is less than stellar. So HP much above about 250-275hp is probably going to stress them to the point of failure. And since they aren't performance oriented to start with, I don't know of any build kits for them. But check around. Try Astro Performance. They are the guys that make the aftermarket T5 build kits to get them to handle 500hp.

[mccombs]

Maybe I've misunderstood. Are the adapters for 4wd only because mine is 2wd.

If that's the case with a t5 work with only needing the correct bell housing?

[cgrey8]

Yeah. Any strong enough standard T5 will work just fine on a 2wd.

Although unless the engine is built OR you plan on hard-shifting it frequently, a stock World Class T5 built and geared for V8s...like the ones put in Mustang GTs will work just fine. Just be aware that in 94-95 GTs, the bell housing got about an inch longer and thus the transmission input shaft has to be longer to match. These trannys also have 8 tooth speedometer gears instead of the standard 7 tooth. That may sound benign, but the additional tooth can make it more difficult to get your speedometer setup right because it requires more teeth on the cable gear. Ideally, you want the older style transmissions & bell housing to ensure comatibility and avoid issues.

The stock GT T5s are good, but not great. The strongest stock T5 ever made were the Cobra T5s used in 93-95 Cobras rated at 310 ft-lbs. There are a number of "upgrades" Borg Warner did to these transmissions making them very sought after...and also very difficult to find. To get stronger than production equipment, you have to go aftermarket. I run an aftermarket Tremec T5 Z-spec in my own truck which has all the "upgrades" of the Borg Warner Cobra T5 and even stronger with a torque rating of 330 ft-lbs. In fact the only upgrade it doesn't have is the 26 spline input shaft. The Z-spec T5s are still the stock 10 spline but can be upgraded if you have a really compelling need. But truth be known, if you are going to twist a 10 spline shaft, you are hitting the limits of even the Z-spec T5. The Astro Performance T5 kits are rated at 500 ft-lbs and I believe the 26-spline input shaft is part of that kit. Obviously the larger input shaft requires a matching aftermarket clutch disc.

The other options are aftermarket Tremec TKOs, 3550s, and if you have deep enough pockets, a T56 Magnum 6 speed with a 700 ft-lb rating and only available in 26 spline. The T56 also requires a different bell housing. If I had the budget, I'd go with an aftermarket T56 Magnum.

I've heard the stock 96-newer Mustang 4.6L GT T45s will also bolt up, but I don't know anybody that has actually installed one on older vehicles. I think the biggest disadvantage to them is most don't have a VSS/speedometer cable provisions or neutral switches. So best to stick with the tried-n-true 93-older style T5s or the aftermarket Z-Spec.

[mccombs]

Holy info batman. I appreciate it. Helps push me down the path and pick the right now. I'll follow up if I've got any other questions.

[cgrey8]

Here's a nice long read on the history of the T5 that might interest you:
The many different faces of the T5

[Dave]

Myself would rather stay with a std. T-5 upgrade than the T-56. Even if cost was equal, most T-56's still have the .62 OD ratio and not that hugh of a torque rating. The others have the double OD with .5 as the final gear, so unless you are pushing over 500 rwhp in a sleak car, never be able to see sixth gear in a Ranger. I'd stick with either Astro or a G-Force t-5. I've got a six speed my new Mustang with 3.73 gearing and first is just good to cross an intersection.
Davd

[cgrey8]

I'm not sure I fully agree, but I get your point. The standard T56 has almost identical gear ratios as my T5z. The only benefit to it is the higher torque rating and having less of a steep drop in RPM going from 4th to 5th. I do have to admit, the difference in RPM between 4th and 5th is pretty significant.

With the T56 Magnum wide ratio (not the standard T56), you get a wider ratio which is great for people looking to drag race AND get good fuel economy. Right now, I run 3.27s in the rear end. Combined with the T5z's .63 5th gear, I tach 2000 RPMs@75 MPH. If I ran that T56 Magnum with its .50 6th gear, I could run 4.10s in the rear end, get a seriously MEAN 1st and 2nd gear while still attaining that same 2000 RPMs@75 MPH in 6th. Unfortunately, that makes 1st gear almost a useless granny gear under normal streeting. It'd be a stop-n-go and track gear only without some larger diameter tires.

Although if I were running the T56 in my truck, I'd be running with 3.73s. That'd still give me a significant 1st & 2nd gear improvement (not that I need it with the 331 now), while dropping me to 1900@75 and possibly getting me even better cruising fuel economy. So yeah if the T56 Magnum had existed back when I was doing my swap originally AND I had the money, I'd have gone that route. But the Magnum version didn't come about until just a few years ago. And with the 331 & the way I drive the truck, I just couldn't justify the expense or the work it'd take to make it happen. There's too many other things I'd rather spend my money on like seats, rims, paint job, etc if I just had an extra $4500+ burning a hole in my wallet.

But for anybody interested, here's a link to the D&D website selling the T56 Magnums:
D&D Performance>T56 Magnum

D&D is the same place I bought my T5z from.

Oh yeah, and if anybody wants to play around with trans/rear gear ratios to estimate RPM & MPH, here's my Interactive Excel spreadsheet for doing just that:
Interactive Speed-to-RPM Calculator

[MalcolmV8]

IMO the stock T56 is under rated at 450 ft/lbs. My 03 Cobra is 10 years old now and still on the stock T56 (knock on wood) and I drive the car hard. It's a toy. Since April 2006 its made over 650 to the tires.

[cgrey8]

But remember you did find you'd twisted the stock input shaft and then upgraded to the 26 spline. But your point is well taken, the internals are likely more durable than rated or your shifting habits are not as rough as you think they are. I say that because I had a friend with a mid 2000s Trans Am that he ragged out on a regular basis. He went through 3 sets of rear tires in 10kmiles. And during that same time period, he went through 2 of those T56s.

The T56 Magnum, I believe, has the 26 spline shaft from the start. The 10 spline isn't even an offered option.

[MalcolmV8]

Good point. Actually I twisted two stock 10 splines and then switched to a 26 spline. The stock throw out bearing retainer snapped too which is very common so I replaced it with a billet piece and never had an issue with it again. I'm sure my T56 is on borrowed time but just how far it's come shows it's plenty stout. Not looking forward to a $3k T56 Magnum.

[cgrey8]

I don't think I ever heard about the TOB retainer failure. I also didn't remember it was 2 input shafts that twisted. I just remember the photos of the 1 you posted.

BTW generic to the discussion about the T5, I think there's also an output shaft difference between the T5 and T56 thus T56 (std & Magnum) would require a different yoke. I don't know if the T56s use the same transmission mount as the T5s. Going with the T5, I was able to reuse my stock manual transmission's yoke and transmission mount...a few less things to have to buy which is always a welcomed discovery.

[MalcolmV8]

Been a while since I compared but I recall the T56 and T5 mounting locations to be quite different.
TOB retainer failure is quite common when driving them hard for any period of time. My stock one lasted about 3 years before giving out.